[Suggestion]Labels, other ideas & convention query

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thelost
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[Suggestion]Labels, other ideas & convention query

Postby thelost » Fri Apr 07, 2006 10:50 pm

Currently when you right click on a feed item any label that you have currently comes up in the contextual menu. The unfortunate side effect of this is if you end up having alot of labels then you will end up with an extremely long contextual menu. This was obviously an oversight and could do with fixing, just for usability and ease of use.

Also would it be possible so feeds, labels etc can be deleted simply by hitting the keyboard 'delete' button? Anything that means I have to use the mouse less is a good thing.

A query now. This is more a personal preference but it bugs me a bit that feeds are referred to as channels. The same goes for calling tags labels. I know this is picky and perhaps a bit silly, but I just like to have a standard name for certain items across programs. Could there be an option to replace their names with the more common preference?

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Jack
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Postby Jack » Sat Apr 08, 2006 9:08 am

hmmm, I haven't considered how to deal with lots of labels(or tags as you like :) ) But I don't like displaying them in a child menu because that won't be convenient for most people w/o many labels...

You can delete them with keyboard from the channel tree.

I don't have strong opinion either way. When I started GreatNews there were few people heard of Feed. And it's difficult to translate Feed to Chinese. There won't be an option to switch around, but if Feeds/Tags are more popular, I might change to those. Does anyone know what they are called in OS X and Windows Vista?

thelost
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Postby thelost » Sat Apr 08, 2006 10:43 am

It would also be nice to change the name of groups to 'folders' as you have icons representing them. personal preference again.

how about having language files then? what if there were advanced options like this:

[advanced]
CallChannelsFeeds=Y
CallLabelsTags=Y
CallGroupsFolders=Y

or the main menu names were loaded from an external language file which could be tweaked to our content (or left as it is).

The tag problem is harder to solve. I have two ideas so far. Firstly tags can either be channel/group/global. Therefore when you right click on an item to tag it and 'Label Properties' comes up you can attach it to just that channel (say boingboing for instance), the group boingboing is in (news in my instance) or set the tag to global.

Using the boingboing feed as an example:

Channel only

If a tag is marked as channel only it can only be applied to news items in that channel. Therefore it only appears on the contextual menu if I were to right click on an item in the boingboing feed.

group only

If a tag is marked as group only it can only be applied to news items in channels in the particular group the channels are located in. Therefore if I created a tag from a boinboing story with this setting I could apply it to any other news item from any other channel in the 'News' group, where my boingboing feed is located. These tags appear in all the contextual menus for that group, but do not appear in any other groups contextual menu.

Global/Or unset

You can either have a global or unset option. It makes more sense to have a global setting as you generally want to make people control their tagging so they don't accidently end up with a massive contextual menu. Therefore by default when someone creates a tag the tag can be automatically be set to channel/group rather than global.

Global means that whatever channel in whichever group you right click in, your global tags will appear. Generally speaking you will have less gobal tags then you will have group/channel tags. Well that makes sense to me, but it might not be true.

I hope my idea makes sense, I think it would definately help with organizing tags. I know that although I have only just begun to use greatnews that news watches and tags are going to be the most powerful and useful tools to me and I imagine lots of others too.

Oh also one more thing about tags, I like how simple the tag creation window is, but could there be an optional collapsable area where you can add text/background highlighting options, like in news watches? Not useful if you are browsing by tag, but useful if you are browsing a group and see a news item highlighted by a tag color.

My comments about naming conventions are my personal preference, so what I say may not be true for everyone, thats why it might be good to make it optional. In Internet Explorer 7 they refer to rss as feeds.
Internet Explorer 7 also provides new tools to give you direct access to information you want, with built-in support for web feeds known as Really Simple Syndication (RSS).


Apple's official browser Safari refers to rss as feeds too:

Safari puts everything you need to browse, search, view RSS feeds and manage your bookmarks in a clean, easy-to-use navigation bar.


Like I said though if people are comfortable with the terms already in use then they should have the option to keep them the same! Especially if it's more understandable in their particular language. I'm from the UK and so I've encountered rss to mean feeds for a long time, but if in China you call them channels, keep them as such.

PS dude, I just wanna say thanks again for making greatnews, it's very much appreciated.

orchid
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Re: [Suggestion]Labels, other ideas & convention query

Postby orchid » Sun Apr 09, 2006 2:40 am

thelost wrote:A query now. This is more a personal preference but it bugs me a bit that feeds are referred to as channels. The same goes for calling tags labels. I know this is picky and perhaps a bit silly, but I just like to have a standard name for certain items across programs. Could there be an option to replace their names with the more common preference?


I agree it would be better to call channels "feeds", but I'm not sure about labels/tags. "Tags" seems to be used more often in reference to labels applied by the writer of a feed item - like Technorati tags - and I think that might lead to confusion.

(It just occurred to me that a great addition to GreatNews would be to pick up feed items by tags, in the same way that the news search does, but only looking at tags, since so many people are now adding tags to their blog postings.)

wyldphyre
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Postby wyldphyre » Sun Apr 09, 2006 4:45 am

Whilst they are generally an interchangable term, I personally prefer to think of the labels in GN AS labels, since that is how I use them currently. I don't label things as a permanent way of sorting them, more as a temporary marker. If I WAS using them in a more permanent way, then I would probably be inclined to think of them as tags.

I don't think that there is a lot in it really. Most of the applications I have seems use one term or the other, and I don't really care which one it is myself :)

Oh, and on the subject of channels vs feeds, I think feeds would be a more standard name. It might not translate well, but nearly everything RSS application I can recall using called them feeds.

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Jack
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Postby Jack » Mon Apr 10, 2006 7:26 am

I guess Feed is more common than Channel. I will try to change the name in next build.

I will keep the Label for now. gmail uses Label, right? :)

thelost
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Postby thelost » Mon Apr 10, 2006 8:27 am

GreatNews wrote:I guess Feed is more common than Channel. I will try to change the name in next build.

I will keep the Label for now. gmail uses Label, right? :)


heh true. I actually went through the gn_eng.ini and did a string replace. I replaced all instances of Channel/s with Feed/s and all instances of Label/s with tag/s. This worked just fine, except for the Label tree. Why isn't that part of the language file too? By that I mean the tree that says 'All Labels'.

I also had another thought on Labels. Have you considered having a tag cloud? People could right click on a item, click 'label item...' and a box of tags could appear, either arranged by popularity, alphabetically or in a tag cloud with size determining popularity. People could either quickly click on an existing label or make a new one. This means that tagging is no longer a two click process, but it does help to control it.

wyldphyre
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Postby wyldphyre » Mon Apr 10, 2006 8:40 am

The tag cloud idea sounds interesting.

If it was to be implemented, it might be worth having an option to allow a simple interface like we currently have, or a more complex one for the tag cloud concept to be used. Depends on how different the cloud interface ended up being, and whether it would be muh more labour (click) intensive to navigate and use.

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Jack
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Postby Jack » Mon Apr 10, 2006 8:07 pm

Language packs don't have all the strings used in program. I was just too lazy to update them.

Let me check how the tag cloud is used. I have heard/seen them but never really used myself. There're so many fancy stuff in the blogosphere to keep tracking with.


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